GoHens.net

Andy Walter 1/7/24

...."Sooner or later, though, the Hens will have to prove they can win consistently at the FBS level if people are going to keep being interested in Delaware football.

The cautionary tale has always been Massachusetts.

A former conference mate of the Hens, which also won a I-AA national title, the Minutemen moved up to FBS in 2013. In the 11 seasons since then, UMass is just 23-101 with five years in which it failed to win more than one game.

This past season, the Minutemen averaged 10,598 fans at their six home games.

Connecticut was another team that was in the same league with Delaware before switching to FBS. While the Huskies had some early success after moving up in 2002, they are now 40-106 with no winning seasons since 2011.

At the other end of the spectrum is yet another former conference rival of Delaware, James Madison. The Dukes have gone 19-5 in two FBS seasons, were ranked in the Top 25 this fall and played in a bowl game.

But, before it moved up to FBS, JMU had already expanded its stadium to almost 25,000 seats in 2011. The Dukes were also 70-11 in their last six FCS seasons and reached at least the national semifinals five times in that span..."

this is all i have been trying to say while getting accused of being negative / dream crusher and not having a clue.

hensfan40yrs wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 9:01 am this is all i have been trying to say while getting accused of being negative / dream crusher and not having a clue.

This article didn’t say what you have been constantly saying which is that the Hens shouldn’t move up now. It provided examples of what has happened in the past but made no recommendation or offered no opinion, at least the clip Henzone provided. And the article didn’t provide other examples of the many, many schools that didn’t have JMU level FCS success that are doing just fine in FBS. That is something you constantly ignore.

Anyway, the decision has been made as UD finally, at long last decided to move forward and in doing so ignored the voices of the old guard who want to keep waiting or never move.

What was the attendance at UMass before their transition? Maybe the transition has actually improved their attendance.

Perhaps Andy could have done some research so that we could see those stats in order to determine if UMass football attendance has gone up or down since their transition.

Maybe it was mentioned, but not in the clip Henzone provided.

BTW, is that article properly cited?
http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/football_ ... e/2006.pdf

I randomly chose 2006. Can anyone find UMass attendance in those stats?

Hmmmm…

EDIT: the answer was 11,663

During UMass’ championship run.

Just about 1,000 fans difference. Comparing a VERY winning season to their transition seasons in which, as others have mentioned, they played a million miles away from campus.

Something tells me it isn’t all about winning.

You’re welcome.

Umass was a perfect example of what not to do, starting with playing their home games on the other side of the state. Don’t think UD will have that problem.

Well, well, well…what a foolish thread.

UMass…2003, was 8-1 in conference and 10-2 overall in the regular season. Only losses were to FBS Kansas State and to KC Keeler’s Delaware Blue Hens.

Safe to say, winning football.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_UM ... tball_team

UMass home attendance, 2003:

Central CT St 8360
JMU 10,196
UNH 7085
Hofstra 7323
Northeastern 7166
Richmond 6167
Rhode Island 7987

Average: 7626

Udforever1 wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 9:58 am Umass was a perfect example of what not to do, starting with playing their home games on the other side of the state. Don’t think UD will have that problem.

Yes, they played some games in Foxbourough which is over 100 miles from Amherst campus and a 2 hour drive at best. Never made much sense

UMass did a low budget move up. They made a lot of self-admitted mistakes that their program is still paying for. OTOH, JMU had the infrastructure and UD looks much more like JMU did at the time of the transition.

We are not leaving the FCS on top of the world but at least UD is positioned much better than most who are making the move.

At least there were no cheap shots at Coach Carty.

Seriously, what a ridiculous thread.

11 years of attendance…almost half where the team failed to win more than ONE game…and many games played at a stadium 100 miles away from campus…and the average attendance across that decade+ period was only about 1,000 less than when the team last made the championship game and 3,000 MORE than when the team was 10-2 and a title contender.

All about winning.

Nothing like having your thread theory proven as demonstratively false.

Cluck U wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 10:07 am Well, well, well…what a foolish thread.

UMass…2003, was 8-1 in conference and 10-2 overall in the regular season. Only losses were to FBS Kansas State and to KC Keeler’s Delaware Blue Hens.

Safe to say, winning football.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2003_UM ... tball_team

UMass home attendance, 2003:

Central CT St 8360
JMU 10,196
UNH 7085
Hofstra 7323
Northeastern 7166
Richmond 6167
Rhode Island 7987

Average: 7626

Thanks for sharing. It makes sense to me that a bad FBS UMASS team this year would draw more than a very good UMASS team in FCS in 2003. I believe the level of play and competition leads to higher attendance in general. A very bad FBS team is going to always have higher attendance than a very bad FCS team. Unfortunately, the level of play has gotten very poor in the CAA compared to 10-15 years ago. Honestly, who wants to go see some of the newer CAA additions play UD? Definitely, not me…

On the surface Andy is correct…winning can surely boost attendance. Additionally, UMASS and UCONN are cautionary tales…but I heard no mention of those schools by CR during the FBS press conference. But I did hear that we reached out to JMU.

Delaware is transitioning the right way. Will we win immediately and be eligible to back into a bowl in 2025 as JMU and Jaxx State did this year? Maybe not but winning is CR’s goal and the coaching staff is certainly on board. The presser dripped with that goal and confidence to do so.

The simple fact of the matter is, that we could not continue on the current path:

Bryant
Campbell
Hampton
NC A&T
Monmouth

OOC:
Duquesne
Sacred Heart
LIU
St. Francis
DSU (A) twice!
Blood baths at PSU, undermanned and paid peanuts

FLO

That's a few things, off the top of my head.......

"Unsustainable" is the word that comes to mind.

hensfan40yrs wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 9:01 am this is all i have been trying to say while getting accused of being negative / dream crusher and not having a clue.

Same here. Delaware was better positioned 15 years ago to do this. There was a plan. Unfortunately it was not followed through on. The move Delaware is making now does not appear to be one that has been developed and worked on for a significant amount of time. Yes, Chrissi Rawak moved forward the WAC, however if you remember her comment from about a year ago that suggesting a move up to the BOT would get her laughed out of the room it should give you pause. The plan that UD has come up with is pretty recent. Performance of the team prior to Carty was abysmal. RC has shown promise as a coach for the future but are he and the Athletic Department capable of making the move with all the required moving parts? I have no doubt that Chrissi Rawak will get the facility changes needed but will our badly damaged FB program (that is just starting moving forward) make the move successfully? Will we go the way of UConn and UMass or will we go the way of JMU? We certainly aren't making the move the way JMU did it. Stay tuned. Only time will tell. 2026 season should tell us a lot. For what it is worth, I will be renewing my ST but scaling down my investment.

mpwerrell wrote: ↑Sun Jan 07, 2024 12:25 pm On the surface Andy is correct…winning can surely boost attendance. Additionally, UMASS and UCONN are cautionary tales…but I heard no mention of those schools by CR during the FBS press conference. But I did hear that we reached out to JMU.

Delaware is transitioning the right way. Will we win immediately and be eligible to back into a bowl in 2025 as JMU and Jaxx State did this year? Maybe not but winning is CR’s goal and the coaching staff is certainly on board. The presser dripped with that goal and confidence to do so.

The numbers don’t lie.

2003…UMass was winning. 3,000 fewer fans on average than during the years since their transition. 2006…UMass continues to win…but only averaged about 1,000 more than their transitions years (which were dramatically impacted by playing 100 miles from campus).

And that is with football attendance dropping all across the board with so many more options available.

It ISN’T all about winning.

Opponents matter. Facilities matter. Culture matters. Entertainment matters. Game day festivities matter. Plenty of SWAC teams have fans piling in for a party, regardless of record.

And yes…planning matters. Although we failed to plan under previous administrations, it is refreshing that Chrissi has fought hard to break from the cartoonish refusal of our BOT to come into the new century.

Looking forward to the new era of Delaware football.