Sun Belt East

[bluehenbillk]

Ok bbk. I am going to cut through the nonsense including the definition of “back sliding”. I made a prediction that UD will be in FBS by the 2025 season. I don’t need any qualifiers to make that prediction. What do you think?

Also, since I can’t resist, who said the magic number for Sun Belt membership is 14 teams, since this is a Sun Belt thread? Anyway, there is a home for UD at FBS if they want one. And it looks like UD is trying to find one. Once again, I bet they will, and soon.

I’ll take the over and say UD if not FBS by 2025.

This is for you and Bluewyn Gold. Why would the Sun Belt, already at 14 teams, want to add more? What’s UD’s sales pitch to the Sun Belt?

Just throwing my two cents in on the magic number for a G5 conference. Maybe it's 14, maybe it's 16? The argument that why would a G5 conference want to share it's part of the college football with more schools (right now they split it up 14 ways, splitting it up 16 ways would seem to make it less per school) is the biggest thing why these conferences wouldn't expand, but people said the same thing about the P5 conferences expanding more and yet they found ways to incorporate the Pac-12 schools. Heck, some even got more inventive and limited the amount of TV money they new schools could tap in to for several years. The G5 schools could do the same - adding teams that don't take a full share of the money right away, and for some time. That seems to be the biggest argument - why share money with other schools not already G5. But the P5 schools figured it out.

As for a reason why to expand, I'd look no further than the CAA this year. Delaware has moved up to 5th in the FCS polls, and have done so entirely on the fact that they haven't lost to an FCS team. We all know that the record is partly due to a weak schedule, but in the end the record is still really good. Parity, when it comes to conference champs and getting higher rankings, isn't really a great thing. The SEC figured this out awhile ago. The Pac 12 never did. The more teams you have in a conference, the less "tough" games you have to play in a conference, and the better chance to have an undefeated team rise up the rankings - maybe even two teams. Now, the Pac 12 imploding has left 4 P5 (soon to be P4) conferences, so that's now just 4 of the 6 automatic bids. That's 2 bids now the G5 schools can go after. Having your conference champ be undefeated will surely help in the rankings. Look at Air Force and Tulane as examples - Air Force is undefeated and ranked ahead of Tulane with one loss. Air Force has played a weaker schedule, and might very well not be as good as Tulane, but the record trumps that. Elevating a team from your conference with a better record, even if it's the result of a weaker schedule, is beneficial to get one of those last two automatic bids.

Good post GF, $ is definitely the biggest thing standing in UD’s way as the existing teams in whatever league would make less. UD adds no real value in a TV deal so that doesn’t help. Could UD do something like SMU and Cal and offer to not take or take less $ for a period of time? Maybe.

[bluehenbillk]

It's not my job to sell UD to the SBC, MAC, CUSA, etc.

Translation: “yea I got nothing” haha

[Hens79]

It's not my job to sell UD to the SBC, MAC, CUSA, etc.

Translation: “yea I got nothing” haha

Another translation. I will ignore almost all available information to form my opinions and then start “just asking questions” when challenged. We see a lot of that in certain segments.

[Bluewyn Gold]

Translation: “yea I got nothing” haha

Very lazy attempt, William. Reading the entire post might help you better understand the concepts being discussed. Sorry to wake you.

[Steve1981]

The danger of 16 teams is the WAC and the MWC splitting off.

[Housthen18]

I’ll take the over and say UD if not FBS by 2025.

This is for you and Bluewyn Gold. Why would the Sun Belt, already at 14 teams, want to add more? What’s UD’s sales pitch to the Sun Belt?

Just throwing my two cents in on the magic number for a G5 conference. Maybe it's 14, maybe it's 16? The argument that why would a G5 conference want to share it's part of the college football with more schools (right now they split it up 14 ways, splitting it up 16 ways would seem to make it less per school) is the biggest thing why these conferences wouldn't expand, but people said the same thing about the P5 conferences expanding more and yet they found ways to incorporate the Pac-12 schools. Heck, some even got more inventive and limited the amount of TV money they new schools could tap in to for several years. The G5 schools could do the same - adding teams that don't take a full share of the money right away, and for some time. That seems to be the biggest argument - why share money with other schools not already G5. But the P5 schools figured it out.

As for a reason why to expand, I'd look no further than the CAA this year. Delaware has moved up to 5th in the FCS polls, and have done so entirely on the fact that they haven't lost to an FCS team. We all know that the record is partly due to a weak schedule, but in the end the record is still really good. Parity, when it comes to conference champs and getting higher rankings, isn't really a great thing. The SEC figured this out awhile ago. The Pac 12 never did. The more teams you have in a conference, the less "tough" games you have to play in a conference, and the better chance to have an undefeated team rise up the rankings - maybe even two teams. Now, the Pac 12 imploding has left 4 P5 (soon to be P4) conferences, so that's now just 4 of the 6 automatic bids. That's 2 bids now the G5 schools can go after. Having your conference champ be undefeated will surely help in the rankings. Look at Air Force and Tulane as examples - Air Force is undefeated and ranked ahead of Tulane with one loss. Air Force has played a weaker schedule, and might very well not be as good as Tulane, but the record trumps that. Elevating a team from your conference with a better record, even if it's the result of a weaker schedule, is beneficial to get one of those last two automatic bids.

Good post GF, $ is definitely the biggest thing standing in UD’s way as the existing teams in whatever league would make less. UD adds no real value in a TV deal so that doesn’t help. Could UD do something like SMU and Cal and offer to not take or take less $ for a period of time? Maybe.

SMU raised $100 million within 7 days of the ACC announcement. Newark, Delaware, ain’t exactly Highland Park, Dallas, but there have to be some alumni somewhere who can pull together some nice funds.

[Section J]

You guys get bent out of shape really easy. Here’s all I’m saying:

1- is UD researching a FBS move? I hope so, probably, but it wouldn’t be the first time. Do they probably get a sense of having been left behind? I hope so. Do they have the appetite to fork out the revenue to play at the FBS level? Unseen. It’s a lot more than the facility upgrades. You have the extra FB scholarships, you’d have to add a women’s scholarship team with scholarships for Title IX purposes, you’d have a big increase with NIL money - what the y do now doesn’t compare.

2- my doors closed comment. The only two possible scenarios today that exist with moving up are the MAC - and no one has said they’re interested in adding and CUSA. Do I believe UD has been offered and turned down? Sure. UD probably blew the Sun Belt off years ago and they blew the A-10 off in the 90’s. All moves that if were made years ago would’ve put UD in a different and most likely better scenario today

3- the Sun Belt and AAC aren’t an option. They’re most likely not going to be an option for years because of the membership size of their leagues and the CFP payout. Can that change? Yes, chances are some of you won’t be alive to see it by the time it does. Sorry if that hurts but barring more seismic level changes that’s where things are at

I don’t see anything happening that quickly - I heard KT say “18 months at the earliest”.

Wake me for the press conference, I’ll probably be happy if/when it happens but just like everyone making the decisions - the path forward is far from crystal clear

I'm with you, your logic is sound.

[Baltimore Hen]

Personally I prefer the MAC simply because I believe we'd be competitive more quickly, if not right away, and for the travel distance, especially the non revenue sports. Conference USA is so spread out across the country and really how is UD going to be able to make any real rivalries in that conference, let alone the expense of the travel? I'd take it at this point, but that move makes no financial sense. As some others have said, the Sun Belt would be the gold standard for our move up, but I'm not sure that invite is coming, at least not quite yet anyway. Hopefully behind the scenes more is happening on that front. I mean if JMU, CCU, Liberty, Georgia Southern, can pull off the move then a state flagship university like UD certainly should be able to pull this move off

all for moving up, but the MAC is about as exciting and interesting as the CAA right now. Not one single palatable school in that conference. NONE care about football. NONE!

[Info Hound]

all for moving up, but the MAC is about as exciting and interesting as the CAA right now. Not one single palatable school in that conference. NONE care about football. NONE!

That's probably a bit harsh. I have no knowledge of what FBS opportunity might open, but the MAC East has a couple of pretty good teams in it:

Ohio U. 6-2, beat Iowa State at home. 22k in their 24k stadium, played at SDSU, lost 20-13, played at FAU (AAC), won17-10
* I would certainly enjoy those OOC games*

Miami (OH), 6-2, played at Miami, (FL) lost 38-3, Beat Cincy at home before 19k+, beat UMass in Amherst.

MAC West has:

Toledo, 7-1. Lost at Illinois 30-27, San Jose at home win before 20k, beat UMass in Amherst.

I didn't look at all the teams. They are a mixed bag, but I think it would be meaningful competition, in which we could quickly be successful.

Certainly would be an upgrade over what we play now, with a destination bowl game and better exposure, plus more revenue. I think they also have a league championship game.

[Henny]

Personally I prefer the MAC simply because I believe we'd be competitive more quickly, if not right away, and for the travel distance, especially the non revenue sports. Conference USA is so spread out across the country and really how is UD going to be able to make any real rivalries in that conference, let alone the expense of the travel? I'd take it at this point, but that move makes no financial sense. As some others have said, the Sun Belt would be the gold standard for our move up, but I'm not sure that invite is coming, at least not quite yet anyway. Hopefully behind the scenes more is happening on that front. I mean if JMU, CCU, Liberty, Georgia Southern, can pull off the move then a state flagship university like UD certainly should be able to pull this move off

all for moving up, but the MAC is about as exciting and interesting as the CAA right now. Not one single palatable school in that conference. NONE care about football. NONE!

This is not true. Agree, a couple teams in the MAC East are struggling but overall, a much better situation than the current CAA.

[HENJOHN]

A MAC team beats a Big 10 team almost every year. Just recently one of lower MAC teams, Bowling Green Beat Ga Tech handily at their place. I don't know where in the heck we'll end up but criticizing that conference blindly isn't right

[Roger_Podacter]

^^^^^^

Agreed.

I would not mind at all seeing Delaware Football in the MAC.

[Hens79]

all for moving up, but the MAC is about as exciting and interesting as the CAA right now. Not one single palatable school in that conference. NONE care about football. NONE!

That's probably a bit harsh. I have no knowledge of what FBS opportunity might open, but the MAC East has a couple of pretty good teams in it:

Ohio U. 6-2, beat Iowa State at home. 22k in their 24k stadium, played at SDSU, lost 20-13, played at FAU (AAC), won17-10
* I would certainly enjoy those OOC games*

Miami (OH), 6-2, played at Miami, (FL) lost 38-3, Beat Cincy at home before 19k+, beat UMass in Amherst.

MAC West has:

Toledo, 7-1. Lost at Illinois 30-27, San Jose at home win before 20k, beat UMass in Amherst.

I didn't look at all the teams. They are a mixed bag, but I think it would be meaningful competition, in which we could quickly be successful.

Certainly would be an upgrade over what we play now, with a destination bowl game and better exposure, plus more revenue. I think they also have a league championship game.

Hard to argue with any of this Info. It beats where the Hens are by a country mile. But somehow folks will argue including those that are just waking up. What continues to amazes me is how confident some folks are when they are dead wrong. Sign of the times I guess.

[rooneyguy]

Personally I prefer the MAC simply because I believe we'd be competitive more quickly, if not right away, and for the travel distance, especially the non revenue sports. Conference USA is so spread out across the country and really how is UD going to be able to make any real rivalries in that conference, let alone the expense of the travel? I'd take it at this point, but that move makes no financial sense. As some others have said, the Sun Belt would be the gold standard for our move up, but I'm not sure that invite is coming, at least not quite yet anyway. Hopefully behind the scenes more is happening on that front. I mean if JMU, CCU, Liberty, Georgia Southern, can pull off the move then a state flagship university like UD certainly should be able to pull this move off

all for moving up, but the MAC is about as exciting and interesting as the CAA right now. Not one single palatable school in that conference. NONE care about football. NONE!

What??? That's just nonsense. I don't have the latest number, but the MAC had 69 players on NFL rosters in 2020. The CAA doesn't come close to that.

[UDJoe]

[quote=rooneyguy post_id=432041 time=1698182982 user_id=27001]
[quote="Baltimore Hen" post_id=432032 time=1698174220 user_id=93]
[quote="Brookside kid hen" post_id=431978 time=1698082668 user_id=68665]
Personally I prefer the MAC simply because I believe we'd be competitive more quickly, if not right away, and for the travel distance, especially the non revenue sports. Conference USA is so spread out across the country and really how is UD going to be able to make any real rivalries in that conference, let alone the expense of the travel? I'd take it at this point, but that move makes no financial sense. As some others have said, the Sun Belt would be the gold standard for our move up, but I'm not sure that invite is coming, at least not quite yet anyway. Hopefully behind the scenes more is happening on that front. I mean if JMU, CCU, Liberty, Georgia Southern, can pull off the move then a state flagship university like UD certainly should be able to pull this move off
[/quote]

all for moving up, but the MAC is about as exciting and interesting as the CAA right now. Not one single palatable school in that conference. NONE care about football. NONE!
[/quote]

What??? That's just nonsense. I don't have the latest number, but the MAC had 69 players on NFL rosters in 2020. The CAA doesn't come close to that.
[/quote]

This September, that number was 45 MAC players on NFL rosters. Still an impressive number for a conference where "None care about football", Just saying,